cc: Kevin Trenberth <trenbert@ucar.edu>, Gavin Schmidt <gschmidt@giss.nasa.gov>
date: Thu, 30 Aug 2007 13:22:04 -0400
from: "Michael E. Mann" <mann@meteo.psu.edu>
subject: Re: Fwd: RE: review of E&E paper on alleged Wang fraud
to: Phil Jones <p.jones@uea.ac.uk>

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sounds good Phil, please let me know if there is any way I can be of 
further help.  There are some folks I could put We-Chyung in touch with 
who could certainly help him out with w/ the legal issues, if he's 
interested. As you might imagine, I have some experience and numerous 
contacts now in this area ;)

mike

Phil Jones wrote:
>
>  Mike,
>     Sending to Gavin is fine. I did mean to say, but forgot.
>  We-Chyung is probably like me too meek and mild to want to go
>  down the legal route, but I'll suggest it to him. I'll also ask
>  him about doing a very brief response about the SUNY process.
>
>  Cheers
>  Phil
>
>
> At 14:01 30/08/2007, Michael E. Mann wrote:
>> thanks Phil,
>>
>> I did take the liberty of discussing w/ Gavin, who can of course be 
>> trusted to maintain the confidentiality of this. We're in agreement 
>> that Keenan has wandered his way into dangerous territory here, and 
>> that in its current form this is clearly libellous; there is not even 
>> a pretense that he is only investigating the evidence. Furthermore, 
>> while many of us fall under the category of 'limited public figures' 
>> and therefore the threshold for proving libel is quite high, this is 
>> *not* the case for Wei-Chyung. He is not a public figure. I believe 
>> they have made a major miscalculation here in treating him as if he 
>> is. In the UK, where E&E is published, the threshold is even lower 
>> than it is in the states for proving libel. We both think he should 
>> seek legal advice on this, as soon as possible.
>>
>> With respect to Peiser's guest editing of E&E and your review, 
>> following up on Kevin's suggestions, we think there are two key 
>> points. First, if there are factual errors (other than the fraud 
>> allegation) it is very important that you point them out now. If not, 
>> Keenan could later allege that he made the claims in good faith, as 
>> he provided you an opportunity to respond and you did now. Secondly, 
>> we think you need to also focus on the legal implications. In 
>> particular, you should  mention that the publisher of a libel is also 
>> liable for damages - that might make Sonja B-C be a little wary. Of 
>> course, if it does get published, maybe the resulting settlement 
>> would shut down E&E and Benny and Sonja all together! We can only 
>> hope, anyway. So maybe in an odd way its actually win-win for us, not 
>> them. Lets see how this plays out...
>>
>> RealClimate is of course always available to you as an outlet, if it 
>> seems an appropriate venue. But we should be careful not to jump the 
>> gun here.
>>
>> Kevin: very sorry to hear about Dennis. Please pass along my best 
>> wishes for a speedy recovery if and when it seems appropriate to do 
>> so...
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> Phil Jones wrote:
>>> Mike, Kevin,
>>>     Thanks for your sets of thoughts. I've been in touch with 
>>> Wei-Chyung,
>>>  who's in China at the moment. He forwarded the 'paper!' to the 
>>> people dealing
>>>  with Keenan's allegations at SUNY. He got a reply to say that Keenan
>>>  has now violated the confidentiality agreement related to
>>>  the allegation. So, it isn't right to respond whilst this is 
>>> ongoing.  I will
>>>  draft something short though, whilst it's all fresh in my mind. 
>>> Then I can
>>>  get onto something else.
>>>      I did send the email below to Peiser clarifying whether he wanted
>>>  a review or just thoughts. I got the amazing reply - sent to three 
>>> reviewers!
>>>      So, letting the SUNY process run its course. Once finished, 
>>> Real Climate
>>>  may be one avenue to lay out all the facts/details.
>>>
>>>   Away tomorrow. I think you have Monday off, so have a good long 
>>> weekend!
>>>
>>>  Cheers
>>>  Phil
>>>
>>>> Subject: RE: review of E&E paper on alleged Wang fraud
>>>> Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:48:43 +0100
>>>> X-MS-Has-Attach:
>>>> X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
>>>> Thread-Topic: review of E&E paper on alleged Wang fraud
>>>> thread-index: AcfqVG3NykjMc9doTBWIfTqkHPH+xwACAfp3
>>>> From: "Peiser, Benny" <B.J.Peiser@ljmu.ac.uk>
>>>> To: "Phil Jones" <p.jones@uea.ac.uk>
>>>> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Aug 2007 16:53:26.0748 (UTC) 
>>>> FILETIME=[1E7969C0:01C7EA5D]
>>>> X-UEA-Spam-Score: 0.0
>>>> X-UEA-Spam-Level: /
>>>> X-UEA-Spam-Flag: NO
>>>>
>>>> Dear Phil
>>>>
>>>> The paper has been sent to three reviewers. Of course I will take 
>>>> your comments and assessment into consideration. Indeed, if the 
>>>> claims are unsubtantiated, I would certainly reject the paper.
>>>>
>>>> I hope this clarifies your query.
>>>>
>>>> With best regards
>>>> Benny
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>>
>>>> From: Phil Jones [mailto:p.jones@uea.ac.uk]
>>>> Sent: Wed 8/29/2007 16:51
>>>> To: Peiser, Benny
>>>> Subject: Re: review of E&E paper on alleged Wang fraud
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>   Benny,
>>>>     Energy and Environment is presumably a peer-review journal. Your
>>>>   email wasn't clear as to whether you want me to review the paper? 
>>>> If you
>>>>   want me to, will you take any notice of what I might say - such as
>>>>   reject the paper? Or has the contribution already been reviewed?
>>>>
>>>>   Phil
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> At 15:18 29/08/2007, you wrote:
>>>> >Dear Dr Jones
>>>> >
>>>> >I have attached a copy of Doug Keenan's paper on the alleged Wang 
>>>> fraud
>>>> >that was submitted for the forthcoming issue of Energy & Environment
>>>> >http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/mscp/ene.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >I was wondering whether you would be happy to comment on its 
>>>> content and
>>>> >factual accuracy. Your comments and suggestions would be much
>>>> >appreciated. We would need your feedback by Sept 17.
>>>> >
>>>> >I look forward to hearing from you.
>>>> >
>>>> >Yours sincerely
>>>> >
>>>> >Benny Peiser
>>>> >Guest editor, E&E
>>>> >Liverpool John Moores University, UK
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> Prof. Phil Jones
>>>> Climatic Research Unit        Telephone +44 (0) 1603 592090
>>>> School of Environmental Sciences    Fax +44 (0) 1603 507784
>>>> University of East Anglia
>>>> Norwich                          Email    p.jones@uea.ac.uk
>>>> NR4 7TJ
>>>> UK
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>>
>>>
>>> Prof. Phil Jones
>>> Climatic Research Unit        Telephone +44 (0) 1603 592090
>>> School of Environmental Sciences    Fax +44 (0) 1603 507784
>>> University of East Anglia
>>> Norwich                          Email    p.jones@uea.ac.uk
>>> NR4 7TJ
>>> UK 
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Michael E. Mann
>> Associate Professor
>> Director, Earth System Science Center (ESSC)
>>
>> Department of Meteorology              Phone: (814) 863-4075
>> 503 Walker Building                    FAX:   (814) 865-3663
>> The Pennsylvania State University      email:  mann@psu.edu
>> University Park, PA 16802-5013
>>
>> http://www.met.psu.edu/dept/faculty/mann.htm
>>
>
> Prof. Phil Jones
> Climatic Research Unit        Telephone +44 (0) 1603 592090
> School of Environmental Sciences    Fax +44 (0) 1603 507784
> University of East Anglia
> Norwich                          Email    p.jones@uea.ac.uk
> NR4 7TJ
> UK 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------                                                                                 
>


-- 
Michael E. Mann
Associate Professor
Director, Earth System Science Center (ESSC)

Department of Meteorology              Phone: (814) 863-4075
503 Walker Building                    FAX:   (814) 865-3663
The Pennsylvania State University      email:  mann@psu.edu
University Park, PA 16802-5013

http://www.met.psu.edu/dept/faculty/mann.htm


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